From the Guardian:


Link to full article.

I'm more worried about Saab than Opel.

I hope it is beginning of some new era in the car industry. The division of these automotive giants into the smaller independent manufacturers could revive "the car" and make it again fascinating.

My, you're quite optimistic. Don't keep your hopes up, you'll probably be disappointed with the outcome of this. It's just anther switcheroo of companies, I doubt there's going to be any major revolution.

I agree, interesting cars don't make money. Smaller companies means the lack of financial weight to push through 'halo cars'.

You are both correct.

Problem A: smaller, independent companies are able to built interesting innovative cars, but there is always not enough financial power behind them them.
@weasel: just look in the history. At least all (app.99%) of smaller car-companies aren't existing any more. Or just as brands inside a mega-company, which is no independence either.
Where are the plenty of British car companies? Where are Borgward, NSU, Glas? Where is Panhard? Where are Packard, Kaiser, Studebaker?


Problem B: The big, multinational companies are too big. Too many employees in too many countires. Don't forget the mental differences!
- DaimlerChrysler was a desaster. Too different brands, too different cars, too different cultures

- Saab lost its independent style after GM took it over. In Europe, I think, in the importan US-market, too, Saab was a car for fanatical individualists with money, who never would like to have a "mainstream" or "conservative" car like Mercedes, Opel or Cadillac. So these old Saab-customers were pissed about the behaviour of GM.

- Similar problems at Opel. The Opel-workers -the VW-people, too!- have two times in their mind, "pre Jose Ignacio Lopez" and "post Jose Ignacio Lopez". In the 90ies he and his guys were a big theme in the German medias. He was a hard, tough "cost-killer", who pressed the subcontractors and their prices very violently.
The final reason was at least, that the quality was going worse. And in Germany the quality is a big thing for the car-buyers, especially if you talk about famous national car-makers like VW, Mercedes Benz and Opel (yes, it's GM since 80 years, but it was always seen at a German company).
Ineed, VW's and Opel's from the Lopez-era were worse than before. Cheaper quality, less reliability. Opel feels this until today. In the early 90ies, pre-Lopez Opel had 17% of the German market, after Lopez it collapsed on 9%. Now it's just 7%.

And Opel had the most problems, when its CEO's were US-Americans and not Europeans. These guys have looked more to Detroit and the shareholder-value and not on the quality and market-position. They neglected the German developments and took over more from the USA. And they coudn't understand, that the Germans don't like that. In the history Opel -Ford, too!- got problems on the German market, when the style of their cars (and especially the quality!) were "too American". The people here don't like that.
Today we see the results harder than ever before.

Look at Mercedes. A real Mercedes-customer had never looked at Chrysler. During the DaimlerChrysler-times both brands were standing in the same showroom, but there was always a hidden border. Mercedes-salesmen and -customers have ignored them and to people, who had been only interested in the Chryslers, they have looked askew.

The car manufacturers have always dissapeared - that's not so big drama, the main problem of our times is the fact, that since many years it is completly not possible to create any new car producer in Europe, mainly because of the "free market" and big international concerns, which are competitors not to defeating in such shape.
So, yes - that's true - existance of smaller manufacturers is impossible in today's politic and economic order, but nothing lasts forever... I like to be optimistic.

Now you can have Opel, Vauxhall and Saab for free:
http://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/0,1518,619854,00.html
You only have to take investitations.

It's written, that GM wants to avoid to pull down the European daughters, when they are collapsing.


I'm asking myself, because nothing is said about that, what will happen with Holden and the South American Chevrolet-company? Their products are mainly based on the European Opel's.

As far as I know, Holden will reamian. The Commodore (also the Caprice and Statesmen) are our own chassis/body/engine, so the that will remain (it is the biggest seller O/S)

For the Astra, Viva, Barina, etc. I don't know. Lets hope they stay

I wonder how much the car company is? I my buy one!!!

You buy a debt, good investment...

@marioman: is this available somewhere?
http://imcdb.org/vehicle_188741-Holden-Commodore-Ute-VR-1993.html

I really would like to have it, but my parents-in-law, who hade made a big cruise half around Australia in Jan and Feb, haven't found it. They really have looked in every harbour, in Sydney, Melbourne, Hobart, Adelaide and Perth, but no shop had it.

Swedish media is reporting right now that Koenigsegg is the buyer of Saab

http://www.thelocal.se/20022/20090611

ingo-I don't think so, I checxked ebay and nothing-I'll looks in stores when I am around town. What did your parents-in-law think of Melbourne?

That could be a good news...

With the Opel/Vauxhall-situtation the most Germans aren't or convinced or satisfied. The deal with Magna-Steyr and the Russian Sberbank is not fixed and nearly all risks are hanging on the German taxpayers. It's not clear, that a insolvence will not happend. The people are just happy, that Opel has left GM 2 days before its insolvency.


@marioman: they liked it (by the few hours, they had time for), but their favourite is Sydney.
Me and my wife had planned to make a big Australia-tour, driving with a rental pick-up across the country and staying at farms with B&B, but then we had bought a house and have spent our money for that...

My wife really envyes her Australian colleagues. She works for the German dependance of the French insurance-company AXA - have you noticed the place, where the AXA-office in Sydney is located? Directly at the harbour-front, close to the Opera, with view on the Harbour Bridge. As we've heard, it's usal for the employees there, to go surfing during their lunchtime...
This really causes heavy-envy-attacs.

Breaking news: GM had decided, not to sell Opel/Vauxhall.